Re: I agree/Kiss/more...
Posted by: Don ()
Date: July 24, 2001 05:21AM

Hi Joe,

I agree with most of what you said here. As a rule of thumb, I try not to get involved with threads like this one. IMO, the potential is there for everyone who joins the thread to have a different perspective of what "overrated" means.

Another topic that I avoid like the plague is anything remotely tied to musicianship. I mean, you could argue for decades, and still never decide what makes a guitar player a good guitar player. To some Yngwie is God. To others, he's a wanker. I've heard very mixed opinions about many of the "greats": Clapton, Van Halen, Lifeson, Vai, etc. I mean, what constitues talent? Speed? Technical proficiency? Originality (and how do you measure that?!)? Feeling (perhaps even more difficult to rank!!)? No, to me it's a pointless waste of time to discuss how "good" or bad musicians are. Musicianship is, TO ME, pretty much impossible to rate. You have some people out there who turn up their noses at anyone with less technical proficiency than the virtuosos, and others who claim that certain players can put more quality into any three notes that they play than what the virtuosos put into an 11 minute solo. So, which one's better? Personally, I always liked Ace Frehley's style of playing. And there's a guy who describes himself by stating that he "doesn't know sh*t from sh...(I can't remember the word he used)" In the end, maybe that's what I like about his style: it's unconventional.

As for Kiss, well, here's what I wrote a few minutes before I read your post...

Geez, I spend two days away from the board, and I miss out on a thread that includes my all-time favorite band being seriously dissed?

I’ll start off with my “to each his/her own” schpiel. I seriously don’t care what anyone else likes or dislikes. I’ve encountered many people through my years (both MHR fans, and those who hate the genre) who have very different taste than me, and I totally respect their right to their opinion.

Now, having said that, it did seem a little ironic to me that, while I was away for two days, Kiss would be not only mentioned, but dissed. Make no mistakes, I realize that there are many people out there who hate the band, the greed of the members, and even the music. But I’ve just got to say a few things here…

-I really enjoy ‘70s rock. For me, this is when it all started. I am a big fan of the likes of Boston, Priest, Deep Purple, Rush, Cheap Trick, Van Halen, Aerosmith, Bad Company, Thin Lizzy, Journey, Black Sabbath, Styx, AC/DC, and, of course, KISSSSSSSSSS!!

-I maintain that, as far as ‘70s AOR/MHR/metal goes, Kiss had (at least for me), many of the most catchy and powerful songs. Again, I understand that people have different taste, and I respect that. But I will never understand how someone could listen to songs like “Detroit Rock City,” “Love Gun,” “Strutter,” “Shout it out Loud,” “Firehouse,” Christine Sixteen,” “Flaming Youth,” “Hard Luck Woman,” “Cold Gin,” etc. etc. etc. and not find them to be full of hooks and catchy melodies. For me, Kiss was the first hard rock that I became a fan of. My love for this band opened the floodgates for virtually every other AOR/MHR/metal band that I’ve come to know and love. And to this day, I have never found a band that has topped that string of 8 albums that they put out in the ‘70s (s/t, Dressed To Kill, Hotter Than Hell, Alive!, Destroyer, Love Gun, Rock ‘n Roll Over, and Alive II). Those albums and those songs are the very essence of everything I love about MHR.

-My brother enjoys some ‘70s rock (Aerosmith, Boston, etc.), but refuses to admit that he enjoys Kiss’ music. He admits that they wrote some very catchy songs, but feels that this is one band that people simply need to outgrow. And I don’t think he’s alone. I’m sure there are many people out there who, deep down might enjoy Kiss’ music, but who associate them with their childhood and see them as being a children’s gimmick, and therefore claim to dislike them. I say, if you enjoy the music, what else matters?

-I could care less about the guys’ musicianship. No, nobody is ever gonna mistake Peter Criss for Neil Peart or Ace Frehley for Eric Clapton. But should that really affect one’s enjoyment of the music? And I really would have a hard time believing that their musicianship skills lapse that far behind many other MHR artists from the ‘70s and ‘80s. And, what they may have lacked n the musicianship department, they certainly made up for with their distinctive style. Kiss’ music is instantly recognizable, and Ace has a very unique style of playing.

-While their musicianship skills may have been average (okay, or even arguably below average), they sure put on an entertaining show! Couple that with their catchy songs, and IMO, you have a band who is capable of offering a great deal of enjoyment to any listener. For me, this isn’t nuclear physics. The hook-laden rock songs are (and should be) enough. The entertainment thing is a bonus. Like the costumes and image or hate ‘em, the songs are there. And, to these ears, the songs stack up very well against any of the other “great” MHR artists of the ‘70s.

-They even did disco well! IMO, in the history of the genre, nobody ever recorded a better disco tune than “I Was Made For Lovin’ You.” Plus, they did pop well, too. “Shandi” is a brilliantly crafted pop song, as are many of the tracks on their pop albums.

-I’m not a huge fan of much of what they did in the ‘80s or ‘90s. I consider the majority of their post-‘70s stuff to be mediocre. For me, the ‘70s is when they really shone.

Okay, okay, I’ve had my say. I know that there will be more of you out there who disagree than agree. I just had to share my opinion. Kiss is a very easy band to trash. There’s lots to focus on (the costumes, the show, the greed, the “ghost musicians,” etc.). But for me, it’s all about the songs. And I find the hooks in their songs to be truly infectious.
Flame on,

"Even crap can be enjoyable sometimes."

...Amen! At times I can derive pleasure from totally unoriginal, unimaginative music played by musicians whose skills leave a great deal to be desired (like Kiss, for example, LOL!!!) in the same way that I sometimes derive pleasure from eating a McChicken sandwhich and Super Size order of fries. To me, music would be boring if it was always about being "gourmet."
Over and out,

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SubjectViewsWritten ByPosted
What a herd of picky bastards we are. 132 The Other Joe 07/24/2001 04:30AM
all overrated rock! classic! 77 sfk kurt 07/24/2001 05:14AM
Re: I agree/Kiss/more...83 Don 07/24/2001 05:21AM
Re: What a herd of picky bastards we are. 86 Misterpomp 07/24/2001 07:51AM

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