For Dennis, Styx is very much a part of him. It's part of his identity. And he feels like that has been taken away. It's like someone has taken away a part of himself from him. It's easy for us to sit on the outside and see that Dennis's musical interests have strayed from what Styx is about. But what Dennis sees is someone taking something that's a part of him away from him. Styx is a part of him and he doesn't want to lose it, but he feels like he is. Dennis needs to deal with who he is. It's like, he's going through a personal identity crisis. He needs to resolve for himself the issues of who he is and what part of him Styx is. And the only way he will get Styx back is by letting go of Styx. Otherwise either there will be no Styx or Styx will continue to go on without him. If Dennis can let go of Styx, then there will be the possibility of a reunion between Dennis and Styx. If you think about it, Chuck let go of Styx. He didn't say Styx couldn't tour without him, or should wait till he is willing and able to tour. Chuck said "I don't want to tour right now, so let's get Glen to play bass, and Styx can still tour" (not an actual quote, just a summary of what he did). Chuck understood that if Styx toured without him, there would still be a Styx for Chuck to be a part of. I think Dennis needs our prayers. You all might not agree with what I've said here. And I can't prove my perspective is right. But I hope you will give it some consideration. And if you don't agree, we can agree to disagree.http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7088#msg-7088Sun, 26 May 2013 13:23:54 +1000 Phorum 5.2.16 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7259#msg-7259 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7259#msg-7259 Captain Chaos NoticeboardWed, 18 Oct 2000 03:33:25 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7258#msg-7258 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7258#msg-7258 Captain Chaos NoticeboardWed, 18 Oct 2000 03:31:22 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7185#msg-7185 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7185#msg-7185 Bladesian NoticeboardTue, 17 Oct 2000 02:31:34 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7184#msg-7184 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7184#msg-7184 Bladesian@netscape.net NoticeboardTue, 17 Oct 2000 02:30:51 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7183#msg-7183 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7183#msg-7183
That's what I get for posting something I wrote for another forum without thinking about the difference audience here and adjusting it accordingly!

I should have said, that I hope those who care about the band members as people will consider what I said, or something like that. :-)]]> Bladesian NoticeboardTue, 17 Oct 2000 02:26:20 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7170#msg-7170 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7170#msg-7170I would argue that the main reasons we all love AOR is the perfect collision between controlled power (not full metal ) and vocals-how many AOR bands are fronted by James Hetfield or Dave Mustaine? So with that in mind the Styx debate comes down to whom do you like?
James Young (you have to be joking in my opinion), Tommy Shaw or Dennis De Young?
I always found Dennis far too over-blown and operatic for my liking (of course I loved Suite Madame Blue and Come Sail Away ) whereas Tommy Shaw was my favourite-witness his solo albums. But that is what puts the slant on my feelings-I'm quite happy for Styx to be Tommy Shaw's band because he is the vocalist for me-bit like in Fleetwood Mac I wouldn't care if Christine McVie left as long as Steve Nicks stayed (cue libellous comment about drugs....).
So with Styx I'm not mourning the departure of Dennis Young-and I saw them last year and it might as well have been Tommy Shaw solo.
The rest of it is all about money and how grasping or greedy the various members appear to be and how you view this depends entirely on how you feel about each member. Just list your favourite tracks and then see who comes out on top-I think that would give us all a real perspective on what we think.
All the best Paul]]> paul stephenson NoticeboardMon, 16 Oct 2000 22:28:14 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7152#msg-7152 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7152#msg-7152
However, you have misunderstood what that means. And you have somehow misinterpreted that simple statement as some kind of broad conclusion about how I think or feel about people, feelings, and justice.

I don't really understand how people can make such strong statements about who is being cheated and who is being hurt in this case. Clearly no one here is intimately involved with any of the band members and is privy to all the official and unofficial agreements and disputes between them. Clearly no one here has viewed and understands the legal contracts that are in dispute. Support of one side or the other may be construed in some bizarre way as loyalty, but it is blind loyalty. It is fan loyalty.

There are two separate sides to this dispute and each side makes an absolute claim to truth and righteousness. 35 years of living on this planet have taught me that the truth probably lies somewhere in the middle and that people that pick one side over the other aren't choosing for any reasons other than individual bias.

What I wonder is if you people really get this wrapped up about human feelings, and people, and injustices that happen in everything that touch your lives in some way. I don't. I'd go crazy if I tried. I care intensely about my family. I care greatly about my friends. I care a good bit about acquaintances. I care somewhat about complete strangers and would help out in some kind of good samaritan kind of way. Beyond that, I don't have the time or emotional energy.

I think most people are that way. However, some whacked fans go so far as to include their favorite artists into that inner circle. I think these types of people are instable. I don't personally know you Captain Chaos so it is difficult for me to judge, but your posting does imply that you feel justified about the strength of your feelings. I don't know, maybe Dennis is an old friend to you.

Joe

Captain Chaos wrote:
-------------------------------
You and Joe are saying that you could care less about the musicians themselves and their feelings. You don't care if someone is making money off of the other guys songs. None of those things bother you at all as long as they are doing something musically that is pleasing to your ear. Human feelings and people getting cheated in real life are just things that you don't need to concern yourselves with. After all they aren't humans anyway, they are just musicians and it's their sole purpose to make good music. Who cares who gets hurt in the process.]]> Joe NoticeboardMon, 16 Oct 2000 08:59:54 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7135#msg-7135 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7135#msg-7135
This information was told to me and only a few others that I know of (because they were present at the time) and we were all asked to keep it confidential. I will never disclose this information in a forum such as this nor will I ever go back on a promise to someone I care about. All I ask is that you please accept that explanation. Until this information is made public by someone else, I will never break a friend's confidence and reveal it myself.

I have only mentioned this knowledge because I had been made to feel as if my opinion/viewpoint was without merit. I would never have even claimed to have such knowledge here if I did not feel as if I had to explain myself all the time.

I'm sorry if this explanation is not what you had wanted, but I hope you understand.

Rocker Chic


]]> Rocker Chic NoticeboardSat, 14 Oct 2000 09:34:45 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7133#msg-7133 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7133#msg-7133
It has to do with a group of people screwing over another person.

]]> Kilzer NoticeboardSat, 14 Oct 2000 08:10:06 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7132#msg-7132 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7132#msg-7132
Rocker Chic, I like you, I really do, you seem like a nice person, you are a very good debater and you are good at making your points but when you start with the "privy to information" stuff it just makes me cringe. If you really are privy to information then why bother even bringing it up if you are not going to share it with all of us? That just leaves all of us wondering if you really are "privy to information" or if you're just trying to make yourself look like you know more than you do.

DK

]]> Kilzer NoticeboardSat, 14 Oct 2000 08:04:48 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7131#msg-7131 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7131#msg-7131What a great concept album that was!

I try to see Joe's point about not caring about the musicians but I can't. These people were a big part of my life back in the day whether I know them personally or not. ]]> Kilzer NoticeboardSat, 14 Oct 2000 07:56:10 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7128#msg-7128 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7128#msg-7128Why can't it be both/and, rather than either/or? I mean, can't we care about the people involved AND the music?

The two issues are seperate, really, though. Though I feel bad and pray for someone whose life is messed up (Steve Clark of Def Lep being a good example), I will buy their works if the music is good, and I won't buy it (or I will regret buying it!) if it sucks.

Personally, I can see both sides of the Styx situation. To be honest, I am not really a huge Styx fan. Most of their albums contain a lot of filler, from what I have heard. I did like the Grand Illusion album, and Pieces of Eight was OK. I also liked Edge of the Century, since Glen Burtnick wrote a lot of it. I couldn't stand Mr. Roboto or any of that stuff.

Does anyone else have any recommendations of good Styx albums?]]> DD Dave NoticeboardSat, 14 Oct 2000 07:11:59 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7126#msg-7126 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7126#msg-7126
I'm usually this way...bottom line for me is how I like the music. Period.

I dont care who wrote it, who played on it, who produced it, etc. I do care whether my ears like it.]]> sfk kurt NoticeboardSat, 14 Oct 2000 06:45:25 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7125#msg-7125 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7125#msg-7125
No matter what my "personal" feelings are, I will never spend money on mediocre works. I have wasted far too many US dollars on things in the past that turned out to be a big waste. There are several people in this world that have been billed as idiots, rude, unappreciative, etc., by others, yet I can still enjoy their works -- I don't have to hang out with the person. However, it is when I find that they are *not only* talented, but also very sweet, kind, humble, etc., that I will go the extra mile to promote them. However, this does not mean that I will belittle anyone for enjoying something that a person creates just because I may personally dislike the artist who has created it.

Rocker Chic ]]> Rocker Chic NoticeboardSat, 14 Oct 2000 05:01:08 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7119#msg-7119 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7119#msg-7119 Captain Chaos NoticeboardSat, 14 Oct 2000 03:25:46 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7116#msg-7116 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7116#msg-7116
End of story.

Rocker Chic
]]> Rocker Chic NoticeboardFri, 13 Oct 2000 23:42:55 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7107#msg-7107 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7107#msg-7107
As much as I love the old Styx and the old Van Halen (and especially the old Journey), I must say that it is a disapointment to me that these bands haven't been able to work out their internal problems- shit happens left and right- that's the way it goes. But I refuse to let the inner bickerings of a band to take anything away from the appeal of a new CD and/or tour, regardless of the circumstances. I'm gonna like it or I'm gonna hate it- regardless of who's playing in the band. If there's a change in the line-up of a band, I approach it as if it's a new band- I'm gonna like it or I'm gonna hate it (I'm repeating myself now!). I'm just glad these guys are still at it.

In a perfect world, Perry would be back with Journey (although I think Augeri will do just fine), Deyoung would be touring with Styx (although Gowan seems to be doing very well on the tour), and Roth would be in VH again (I'm selfish...). The problem is that there are no guarantees in life, especially the music biz. I'm just glad that these bands are still out there doing what they do best- rock our worlds. For all of you nay-sayers out there: always remember that it could be worse- there might not be a Journey or a Styx or a VH now...

One thing that we should keep in mind is that these bands (and other AOR staples) can disappear as early as next week due to the ever-changing trends of music (i.e. the flavor of the day.). Regardless of the changes in the line-ups in MHR/AOR bands, we MUST support them- even if it's not the "perfect world" we have hoped for.

nuff said...

C]]> c dog NoticeboardFri, 13 Oct 2000 14:55:53 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7098#msg-7098 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7098#msg-7098
I don't care how Dennis feels. I don't care about how the "fake" Styx members feel. None of these people are friends of mine. I have absolutely no stake in their relationship whatsoever.

My brand loyalty to the Styx product is zero. My brand loyalty to the Dennis Deyoung product is zero. Musicians grow. Musicians change. Band members come. Band members go. There's no guarantee that I'll like something new from an artist just because I liked something old from an artist. If Dennis puts out good music that gets good reviews from trustworthy reviewers and sounds interesting on my Napster downloads, I'll buy it. If the fake Styx puts out good music that gets good reviews from trustworthy reviewers and sounds interesting on my Napster downloads, I'll buy it.

I have no cares whatsoever about the inner workings or politics of either the Styx or Dennis Deyoung music production factories, I only care about the finished products. If there is some kind of legal issues going on, I say let the lawyers and the judges and the stakeholder parties deal with it. I don't really care.

I'd rather not read about this crap on the web. I'd rather not read about this crap in the newsletters I receive. I'd rather not read about this crap in the magazines I buy. I'd rather these information brokers spent their precious bandwidth and pagewidth on musical stuff, like when the old Sugarcreek material is gonna finally be released on CD and stuff that's useful like that.

I don't think we should sit around psycho-analyzing a bunch of people we don't know and with whom we have absolutely no relationship. I listen to music for how the music makes me feel, not how it makes some poor schmucks who I don't know who live 400 miles from me feel. I'll let Dr. Laura and others do the psycho babble. I'm gonna just tune it out. I can't figure out what any of it has to do with the music.

Same thing goes about a million times over for the Van Halen soap opera also.

Rant over. Let the music do the talking.

Joe

---------------------------------------------------------

Bladesian wrote:
-------------------------------
For Dennis, Styx is very much a part of him. It's part of his identity. And he feels like that has been taken away. It's like someone has taken away a part of himself from him.

It's easy for us to sit on the outside and see that Dennis's musical interests have strayed from what Styx is about. But what Dennis sees is someone taking something that's a part of him away from him. Styx is a part of him and he doesn't want to lose it, but he feels like he is.

Dennis needs to deal with who he is. It's like, he's going through a personal identity crisis. He needs to resolve for himself the issues of who he is and what part of him Styx is. And the only way he will get Styx back is by letting go of Styx. Otherwise either there will be no Styx or Styx will continue to go on without him. If Dennis can let go of Styx, then there will be the possibility of a reunion between Dennis and Styx.

If you think about it, Chuck let go of Styx. He didn't say Styx couldn't tour without him, ....]]> Joe NoticeboardFri, 13 Oct 2000 12:09:34 +1100 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7088#msg-7088 http://www.melodicrock.com/phorum52/read.php?1,7088,7088#msg-7088
It's easy for us to sit on the outside and see that Dennis's musical interests have strayed from what Styx is about. But what Dennis sees is someone taking something that's a part of him away from him. Styx is a part of him and he doesn't want to lose it, but he feels like he is.

Dennis needs to deal with who he is. It's like, he's going through a personal identity crisis. He needs to resolve for himself the issues of who he is and what part of him Styx is. And the only way he will get Styx back is by letting go of Styx. Otherwise either there will be no Styx or Styx will continue to go on without him. If Dennis can let go of Styx, then there will be the possibility of a reunion between Dennis and Styx.

If you think about it, Chuck let go of Styx. He didn't say Styx couldn't tour without him, or should wait till he is willing and able to tour. Chuck said "I don't want to tour right now, so let's get Glen to play bass, and Styx can still tour" (not an actual quote, just a summary of what he did). Chuck understood that if Styx toured without him, there would still be a Styx for Chuck to be a part of.

I think Dennis needs our prayers.

You all might not agree with what I've said here. And I can't prove my perspective is right. But I hope you will give it some consideration. And if you don't agree, we can agree to disagree.]]> Bladesian NoticeboardFri, 13 Oct 2000 09:31:10 +1100